Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

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Tunguska
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Tunguska » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:32 pm

Midnight Rose wrote:I must just go and check with the other moderators but I would love to use some of those pictures in my article about buying from petshops if you would be happy with that. I think they say so much more than I ever could about why I am disgusted by that trade.

I've seen these things myself, I'm a scientist after all, but I've never been allowed to take photos.


Of course you can use them, thanks for noticing me :)

I try to take a neutral stance in this thread as I do think it was very nice of the man to allow us in and take pictures and I would feel bad to immediately turn around behind his back and shout 'look at the horrible things he's doing!', but it's hard :-?

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by wildjasmine » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:43 pm

No words :evil: :evil: just deep sadness for these poor poor souls :cry: :cry:

Estelle i totally agree with you on the sticky on this thread, lets hope it can be.
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Hanlou » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:48 pm

Estelle wrote:If ever there was a thread that should be left stickied to remind us why we should not support the pet shop industry...


Agreed Estelle. It's too awful for words..... :cry:
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by SarahP » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:53 pm

When people come on the forum and say 'well this rat was in the pet shop all on its own and I couldn't just leave it. It is only the one I'm buying, it won't make a difference' and the answer is 'think of the bigger picture' ... well this 'is' the bigger picture isn't it :(
I don't know about anyone else but those pictures are firmly engraved in my mind now and I know 'every' time I see animals in a pet shop, those pictures will come into my head. I will see the animals of course and feel for them but I will also see the bigger picture and the ones that are still in these places :(
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Nicola » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:56 pm

I agree, Sarah, that picture of the poor doe stuck in the tiny tank looking after one of many litters she has to raise before ending up as snake food will probably haunt me forever :cry:
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Kitkat » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:00 pm

I'm not easily shocked these days but I honestly feel quite sick looking at those pictures. The one with the three hairless in got to me most as you can see how little space they have. And that is cleaned once a week? It must be vile in there by cleaning day. In fact I think its that pic where you can see the poo smeared up the sides of the box :( Those poor Mum's being constantly bred from and then their thanks is to be somethings dinner. Just heartbreaking :cry:

That man should be ashamed. Very very ashamed. I don't care if you call it a business. He is responsible for the care and welfare of the animals he owns and he is giving them a thoroughly miserable existence. There is no excuse for that. In fact, the fact that it is a business makes it worse because he is knowingly exploiting them to make money for himself.

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Inner Chorus » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:19 pm

Anyone who thinks there is nothing wrong with the pet trade should see these pictures.

It's one thing to be aware of the conditions these rats are kept and bred in, and quite another to actually see it. :(

I am glad that you posted these pictures.
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Holly » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:21 pm

Hanlou wrote:
Estelle wrote:If ever there was a thread that should be left stickied to remind us why we should not support the pet shop industry...


Agreed Estelle. It's too awful for words..... :cry:


Agree too. Those pictures are heartbreaking. :cry: I hate the pet industry so much. It is just so wrong to treat animals like that. :(
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by talamasca » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:24 pm

Before joining this site I never gave much thought to where pet shops get their animals from. Ours were from *that pet shop* and I always bought my animal things from there, but since joining this site and reading about pet shop animals, etc I've started buying from different places and whilst I can't go and shop in just one shop for everything any more, I don't care because I know that I'm not lining the pockets of those businesses who choose to sell animals and buy them from places like this. The worst thing though is knowing that this guy is probably one of the better ones :( :evil:
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Tanya » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:28 pm

:cry: This really has broken my heart to see those poor poor creatures crammed in small tanks with no love and attention. No wonder alot of petshop rats are scared and some of them bite. The poor mothers, babies, hairless and all the other animals :(

I totally agree with Estelle that this should be a sticky just to let people see exactly where most petshop animals come from.

:(
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Tunguska » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:35 pm

Tunguska wrote:Of course you can use them, thanks for noticing me :)


Noticing me = notifiying me :oops: :rollred: *mumbles something about English not being mother tongue*

I do hope this post will convince the unconvinced now and in the future that rescues and proper breeders are the ones to support!

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Karly » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:11 pm

And as an ex-petshop employee, staff would tell people that these animals came from local breeders - so don't be fooled if you get the "we only get our animals from a local breeder who only supplies to us" talk. Yes, it may be true on occasions but from experience the majority of places will get their pets from places like this - it's cost-efficient for them and petshops are businesses too

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by SargentEllie » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:23 pm

Are there regulations here that govern space per animal for these commercial businesses? I know the rules for labs animals are quite strict. I have some of the trays from old lab rat housing in my greenhouse (for planting). They were given to me because they were now to small to use for animals -from those pictures my trays actually look bigger :-? . I would hope that rodent farms have to adhere to the same welfare standards as labs do. If not maybe that’s something we need to campaign to change ....
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Tunguska » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:32 pm

This rodent farm is situated in the Netherlands. It may be possible regulations vary between the UK and the Netherlands. The tubs he used for the rats weren't the largest type, I think (I believe these things are numbered, eg. M1, M2, and I think this is one type below the one you'd usually use for rats).

I also disliked the lack of enrichment. Sure, the breads were a nice addition and some rats tried to sleep under it, but some sort of toy, nesting material or shelter would be such a large improvement. Laboratories are required to provide enrichment (although the laboratory I visited gave the rats a piece of 2 inch string which some tore apart and others neglected; not exactly a long term enrichment).

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by neep_neep » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:43 pm

SargentEllie wrote:Are there regulations here that govern space per animal for these commercial businesses?


I am pretty sure that in the UK, if you are breeding commerically for pet shops (i.e. that is the purpose of your business...not just a hobby breeder selling excess stock) then you are required to hold a pet shop license. So presumably, the pet shop license stocking conditions apply to these breeders also.

Which, considering what the stocking space is for pet shops, it wouldn't surprise me if these breeders were actually acting within the confines of the regulations. :-?

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