Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

For all breeding, rearing and genetics related discussion. Kitten pictures may be posted in "Your Rats".
Purposefully bred litters of any background may NOT be advertised on the Fancy Rats forum.
Locked
User avatar
vm1307
Member
Member
Posts: 3834
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 7:58 pm
Location: Bordon, Hampshire

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by vm1307 » Fri Dec 14, 2007 12:27 am

Tunguska wrote:Image


For me it is this first picture that has most profoundly affected me. For the first few seconds that I looked at it, my brain struggled to make sense of what I was looking at (large warehouse... with boxes of something on shelves... oh my god those are full of animals!) and when i did realise what I was looking at it was literally like a blow to the stomach.

This picture should be put on the front of the care sheets that petshops hand out.

User avatar
katielittle25
Member
Member
Posts: 1750
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:03 pm
Location: Birmingham England

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by katielittle25 » Fri Dec 14, 2007 2:23 am

These pictures have changed a lot for me. I was one of the people who knew buying from petshops is bad but couldn't walk away from a cute face, but now I will never ever ever buy from a petshop again. To be honest I dont even want to buy accessories from petshops who buy from rodent farms. I need to just start buying my rat stuff online me thinks.

To think 3 of my little darlings went through this drives me crazy!!!

These pictures would change a lot of peoples minds, they should definately be published.

What I'd love to do to these people in a room with no windows, grrrr, its horrible, I feel so helpless.

Going to bed not a happy girl.
Mr.Squish
I miss you always Princess, Fredo, Rosie and Lulu :halo:

User avatar
fuzzyfeet
Member
Member
Posts: 469
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 11:17 pm
Location: Hampshire

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by fuzzyfeet » Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:03 am

Well said Vic! I bet people wouldnt return for more at a later date! Those pictures speak volumes.Disney,Willow and Kobi came from a pet shop and i must say at over a year old (kobi is almost 2)they have never had so much as a sniffle and all 3 have temperments to die for too. Would i return at a later date for more? ........no!

Everyone has a right to chose their own path in whatever they wish to do for what ever reason.I dont preach and hate being preached to.One persons way is not always the same as another but i will still say that there is definately something wrong with some one who can treat any lovely animal in this discusting manner....at the end of the day they have rights and feelings too.Rats are hugely intelligent animals capable of forming strong bonds with humans,they dont have to but chose to trust us.Mother rats have amazing bonds with their babies....babies that are probably taken from her too young and rats as we all know are capable of feeling loss and grieving.

I guess at the end of the day all you can do is pity this "man" and his kind.I say that because its his loss.He has no emotional attachment to the "slave rats" he manages,if he did he wouldnt happily let them go for snake bait when they were past it.He doesnt have the bond with "his "rats that we all do with ours.If only he did.......he would know just how much he was missing :( On a personal note i would like to put managers of these rodent farms in the same conditions they force these lovely animals to live in.Tell you what...they wouldnt last 36 hours! A 6ft perspex tank full of shavings,no toilet :D ,a diet of dusty grain and stale chopped carrot complete with 15 youngsters under 3! :D Yes.....as much as i find these pictures upsetting that thought really does lighten my mood :lol:

On a serious note pet shops will sell animals for as long as the public buy them or the government stops it.Education is the way forward on the rodent farm industry and i think Vic's suggestion is great although no pet shop would allow it as its damning their business at the end of the day.I think shops selling rats could be open about where they source their rats from so that a potential buyer could make an informed decision on whether to buy a "Tenko" rat or not but i guess honesty wouldnt be their best policy as i am certain rat sales as well as other rodents sales would fall dramatically if the unsuspecting general public Knew the truth.

karen x

Estelle
Member
Member
Posts: 1241
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2002 6:38 pm

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Estelle » Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:26 am

I do think pet owners can make some difference by boycotting pet shops selling animals and we should be spreading the word to encourage this as much as possible, but on the other side of that, we do need to 'tell' these pet shops our reasons for boycotting them - maybe write some letters, etc. because they are not going to change their practices if they don't know why they are being boycotted. I am sure that a large number of the pet shop employees do not understand where the pets they are selling come from - the management just tell them to say a 'local breeder' or similar so showing them a few pics like these might well open their eyes as well.

Sadly the other side of rodent farms which isn't likely to change and means that rodent farm businesses are not going away is the ever increasing herp market - more and more people keep snakes and other reptiles that require rodents as food and a lot of herps owners really don't seem to care about the source of their animals lunch as long as they can wander into the pet shop and buy frozen rats/mice, etc. To them, these rodents will probably never be seen as pets (or almost even as originally being 'live animals' from the attitude of a few herp owners i know :roll:), so they probably wouldn't see anything wrong in the way the rodent farms raise them.

I visited a rodent farm myself around 3-4 years back (no camera allowed!) and the owner said that when the large chain pet shop opened branches in the UK and also more garden centres started selling rodents it changed their business dramatically from being primarily a 'deadstock' supplier to being both livestock and deadstock, their market increased dramatically as these stores wanted a sale or return policy and to be able to order as much as possible of their 'stock' from the one place. It was far more convenient to order their rabbits, cavies, rats, mice, hamsters, etc. plus all their frozen rodents from the one stockist and helped profit margins and of course sale or return meant that they weren't stuck with the 'too old to sell' stock, which the rodent farms will happily take back and freeze after the pet shop has fed them up for several weeks... Until the point where the big chain pet stores pretty much took over the pet market (around 2000-2001), most small pet shops were supplied by several small local breeders for each type of animal, but in order to compete, they were pretty much forced down the same route of buying all their 'livestock' and 'deadstock' from the same places.

User avatar
Midnight Rose
Fancy Rats Team
Fancy Rats Team
Posts: 16903
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 5:15 pm
Location: South West London, UK
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Midnight Rose » Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:53 am

katielittle25 wrote:These pictures have changed a lot for me. I was one of the people who knew buying from petshops is bad but couldn't walk away from a cute face, but now I will never ever ever buy from a petshop again. To be honest I dont even want to buy accessories from petshops who buy from rodent farms. I need to just start buying my rat stuff online me thinks.


I'm not getting at you katie by what I'm about to say. I think you are very brave and that it's great that you just said the above, I'm only highlighting it because you brought it up and because what I'm about to say is in response to what you said :D

I'm also not about to mince my words in the next paragraph, so I apologise if I upset anyone, I'm just voicing an opinion I usually just shout at my computer screen!

I do get annoyed when people who should know better buy from a petshop or back yard breeder, for whatever reason. Whether it's easier than organising a rat train, easier than having to fill out forms for rescues/breeders or they can't resist a cute face. It makes me disappointed in them and like I have somehow failed because I try and teach people about rat farms. As a result I normally close threads the second I know the cute new rat was bought from a petshop by someone that should have known better and never return to that thread. In my eyes giving anyone money for that sort of treatment of animals, no matter how legal, is wrong and always will be wrong. I don't say that in threads because I feel I cannot preach to anyone and I can't deal with the aggro of being 'righteous', so I stick my head in the sand and pretend those threads don't exist.

I always tell people loudly about why I hate petshops, I knew what was going on in these places but had no photographic evidence to show what I was desperately trying to explain. I think that no amount of reasoned argument (and general yelling!) from me would ever carry the weight of those photos.

I never buy from shops that sell animals. I once stopped shopping somewhere that started stocking animals after telling them why. I always shop online or in shops that don't sell animals. A lot of my animal shopping isn't even done in petshops but in supermarkets, DIY stores and places like poundland.

ETA: I fully support people that raise animals for food ethically, be they chickens, cows or rats. My OH wants a snake, I like snakes, I've told him that he can have a snake if he breeds the food ethically for the snake or sources the snakes food from someone that breeds snake food ethically. It's not easy, but is possible, to find these people.
Valiance Rats - London based rattery breeding to extend average lifespan and improve health in the variety American dove and dove agouti.

North of England Rat Society - Pet Initiative

User avatar
katielittle25
Member
Member
Posts: 1750
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:03 pm
Location: Birmingham England

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by katielittle25 » Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:04 pm

I've thought of an idea; why dont we sticky a list of ethical petshops (ones that dont sell aninals) by area. Giving a list of options may make it easier for people to find a better pet shop rather than just going to their closest p@h. Just an idea x

Oh, Midnight Rose, I dont think you are critisising me, I agree with everything you have said. And I agree it is a shame that you try to get across to people why we shouldn't go to petshops and sometimes it doesnt work, but these images a great and will definately work in changing peoples minds.

Also, are there any petitions around that we could all sign in regards to rodent farms? Or anything we could do to try and change this?xxx
Mr.Squish
I miss you always Princess, Fredo, Rosie and Lulu :halo:

User avatar
squeaky
Member
Member
Posts: 3025
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 5:07 pm
Location: Falkirk, Scotland
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by squeaky » Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:08 pm

For those who have visited similar places, how does the 'scale of farming' here, compare with the pictures? Are UK places larger scale, much the same etc.?
I hate to think how many poor animals are in that one building, but I'm curious if this is average, small scale etc.
Vicki and Mana Rats - Variegated and related markings.
Jerry Jam Rats - handmade rats!
GAL

User avatar
Tunguska
Member
Member
Posts: 176
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:50 pm

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Tunguska » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:46 pm

In regards to the situation in the Netherlands, he told us he's one of the two biggest in our country. I have to admit it was slightly smaller than I expected it to be. I have no idea how this compares to the UK though, which is a far larger country and has - I believe - a far larger rat and mouse fancy. So I wonder about this, too :)

User avatar
PrideRavyn
Fancy Rats Team
Fancy Rats Team
Posts: 3272
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 10:01 am
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by PrideRavyn » Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:11 pm

Two questions...

a)what's the likelihood of anyone getting into a UK one?

and b) does anyone have any pictures demonstrating the size difference between breeder tank and normal rat cage that's for at least 2-3 rats?

oh, and a third - Tunguska, I don;t suppose you took any photos of the other varieties of animals?
Ali and the Rodden Breck!
Brecklagh Rattery - Breeding for Variegated and related markings in Russian Blue and Black

A STATEMENT regarding Melanistic Agouti and our breeding plans.

User avatar
popticle17
Member
Member
Posts: 3272
Joined: Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:19 pm
Location: St Ives, Cambridgeshire

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by popticle17 » Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:50 pm

i can do my work experience at simons rodents if I want too, and can get a lift, if he's willing to take work experience students then getting in wont be hard, its getting out without crying and your heart breaking at the end of the day :(
Chelsea, Cass, Vedder and Rats.

User avatar
Angel'Z
Member
Member
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:48 pm
Location: North Wales

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Angel'Z » Fri Dec 14, 2007 7:26 pm

I feel shocked! I didnt know these places exsisted, I thought that baby rats (and any other baby animal) in pet shops just came from someone who lived locally and whos pet had had babies! I have nine, all from pet shops, I love them but would never have supported this trade had I known about how they were bread.
Zoe

Rolland, Nibbles, Tinkerbelle, Agustus, Smokey, Abbs, Chino, Coco, Honeysuckle

Ratty Bob
Member
Member
Posts: 496
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 4:44 pm
Location: Milton Keynes
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Ratty Bob » Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:11 pm

popticle17 wrote:i can do my work experience at simons rodents if I want too, and can get a lift, if he's willing to take work experience students then getting in wont be hard, its getting out without crying and your heart breaking at the end of the day :(


It would be VERY interesting to see pictures from there :o I might even be pleasantly surprised :roll:
For Everything Chatty Ratville
For Everything Ratty Acrorats

User avatar
Solar
Member
Member
Posts: 4264
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:37 pm
Location: Cambridgshire
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Solar » Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:24 pm

Ratty Bob wrote:
popticle17 wrote:i can do my work experience at simons rodents if I want too, and can get a lift, if he's willing to take work experience students then getting in wont be hard, its getting out without crying and your heart breaking at the end of the day :(


It would be VERY interesting to see pictures from there :o I might even be pleasantly surprised :roll:


I doubt it, I've seen his setup on the web before he changed the website (I think it was his website, but it deffently had pictures of some boxes), it's excatly the same and I doubt that he will allow anyone to take photos and post them on the web. The UK one is the same because that is the most efficiant way of breeding for profit all over the country, if you do a search for rodent breeding boxes and click the UK link you'll find those boxes for sale. Herp breeders use them more or cat litter boxes in low shelving for mice.

You'll end up releasing them all pop lol (and smuggling the cuties home with you) The huntingdon Garden and Lesure get their rodents from Simon's rodents.
The boys: Squadcar, Paddywagon, Alkatraz and Leavenworth

My angels always remembered.

User avatar
PrideRavyn
Fancy Rats Team
Fancy Rats Team
Posts: 3272
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 10:01 am
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Contact:

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by PrideRavyn » Fri Dec 14, 2007 8:52 pm

I think the most awful thing for me about Simons rodents is the sheer amount of animals they breed - has anyone looked at their 'products' pages recently? It seems anything that might be sold is bred there :(

To be honest I'm quite hard hearted when it comes to these kind of things and I think I could go in an see without wanting to be sick, free them all or running out in shock, but I don't know if I could keep my mouth shut :o
Ali and the Rodden Breck!
Brecklagh Rattery - Breeding for Variegated and related markings in Russian Blue and Black

A STATEMENT regarding Melanistic Agouti and our breeding plans.

User avatar
Jird
Member
Member
Posts: 1606
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 9:58 pm
Location: Plymouth

Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Jird » Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:26 pm

That's simply terrible. =/ It makes me so angry to think about the conditions farmed rodents endure, day in, day out. The pic of the mother in that tiny tank with her babies just made me wince.

Tunguska, would it be okay with you if I used a couple of the photos in a college project? I'm writing a booklet on the proper care of fancy rats, and would really like to use a photo or two of yours in the section about sourcing rats. The booklet is not for profit or anything like that, it's just for my lecturer to mark. I'd of course credit you for the photos.
Emily and the boys - Jamie, Bailey, Finn and Tumnus
Love you Bond, Liam, George, Blaze. See you at the bridge little guys.

Locked

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest