Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

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popticle17
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by popticle17 » Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:59 pm

thats what would get to me PR, i would want to take them all, just to give them a hammock at least!

but i wouls struggle to keep my mouth shut, and "help" this guy with his buisiness, i guess i just think its a shame that although they may breed on this scale, they can *at least* give them more space and an igloo!
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Estelle » Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:14 pm

There's 2 pics on this page - http://www.genetic-gems.com/pages/rodents.php
http://www.genetic-gems.com/Images/Rat% ... 20barn.JPG
http://www.genetic-gems.com/Images/Rat% ... rn%202.JPG

this page just left me - :o :roll: :( http://www.frozendirect.com/shop/pages.php?pageid=5 - i also can't believe just how cheap the frozen rodents are on that site either - it really devalues life even more.

The one i visited just had racks and racks of laboratory style cages and plastic boxes as per the ones on the first page of this thread and the ones in the images above and were arranged in age order so it worked on a rotation system on ages - the staff there seemed to have no compassion to the animals at all, they were just 'stock' to them. I don't remember it being quite as clean and tidy looking as either set of images and the smell was pretty ripe as well.

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Rasboozy » Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:26 pm

that has actually bought tears to my eyes. :cry:

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by PrideRavyn » Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:44 pm

The saddest bit about your third picture Estelle was the fact that it indicated 20 female rats were in each of those crates. 20, not three, but more than I would put in a furet tower.
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Rackie » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:01 am

Yeah I noticed that Ali, how on earth can they fit 20 rats into one of those things :(
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Ratty Bob » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:21 am

Looking at those prices,( life is cheap), it really does underline just how cheap life is - and these are the selling price, not the price that they pay the breeder :cry:
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by PrideRavyn » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:34 am

You know, the guinea pig prices have upset me the most - a large guinea pig worth not even half the price of a large rabbit, and even less than an adult rat. What a waste of a life :( And to think what those guinea pigs went through to get the that size, the amount of litters they were forced to feed while they were waiting for the inevitable death that follows and then to be sold for pittance on the internet.
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by PrideRavyn » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:40 am

Not to mention what the adult rat and the large rabbit went through too :(
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by toyah » Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:02 am

Rackie wrote:Yeah I noticed that Ali, how on earth can they fit 20 rats into one of those things :(


I assume the marking meant that at one point there was 20 young females in that particular cage. You couldn't physically fit 20 adult rats in there - if they had 20 breeding does in each, they'd be crammed in so tight the lid would never close.

Interestingly, some of the people I know who do breed their own rats for use as feeders now use cardboard bedding, as well as paying more attention to diet (one guy borrowed my "scuttling gourmet" recently, and seemed quite positive about it). Better bedding, diet and cage size have positive impacts on not only the rodents but also the snakes!

How many people on this forum do you think are happy to use cheap *please do not swear* dog food containing meat from horrendously cared for chickens, and buy caged hen eggs? Maybe not the vocal minority, but there's a hell of a lot of people turning a blind eye to it. I bet no chicken fancier buys caged hen's eggs though! It's always more horrendous when it's "your" species.

I doubt that many herp people know about the conditions the rodents are in - or have even thought about it, much like the situation with battery eggs. Mostly, I think that they don't even realise why it's bad when they do see - they can see the animals have food, have water, are obviously healthy and happy enough to breed ... the place looks clean enough generally - not everyone knows how much space these animals need, or why those conditions are not suitable.

But educate, tell people, and some will listen. Tell them why they need more space - I have been doing that, and also I have been pushing the fact that rats in bigger cages tend to be fitter, more muscular - surely better "breeding stock" and even prey items than a rat stuck in a tiny cage unable to exercise? That feeding a varied and complete diet will result in strong, healthy, happy babies that grow faster and are probably more nutritious. These places will never be banned or closed down, but even if a significant minority of the market for these animals demands better production values and is willing to pay for it, then someone will supply it - and once that starts, then we are making bigger steps towards eventually making these places more acceptable. But they're businesses, and they're never going to be keeping pairs in Duettos ... pet rat owners will never be happy with the way these places must be run.

Life is indeed cheap, rattybob. To be honest the bit that makes me saddest is the chicks. They're £30 for 1,000. three pennies for an entire chick. They're so cheap that often they don't get bought to feed to something else, they're purchased simply because they're cheaper than ice packs to keep the rodents cold in transit. I can understand the rodent industry and the fact that they produce meat to feed to other animals - it's not pleasant, but it's at least a reason for them being created. But I can't quite get my head round an animal's contribution to the world being viewed as simply a throw-away substitute for dry ice :( Since I realised just how cheap and disposable they were, I must admit I have eaten a lot less in the way of eggs and chicken...
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by tabirat » Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:45 am

How many people on this forum do you think are happy to use cheap *squeak* dog food containing meat from horrendously cared for chickens, and buy caged hen eggs? Maybe not the vocal minority, but there's a hell of a lot of people turning a blind eye to it. I bet no chicken fancier buys caged hen's eggs though! It's always more horrendous when it's "your" species.


Yep... and how many feed Reggie rat, PAH nuggets etc etc... all containing meat derivatives sourced from mass battery production. I think it is easy to be enraged about rats... but I do think they fair better than some other species. Mass farming of anything leads to suffering on a grand scale. I even heard some rat lovers a few months back discussing how 'free range eggs' weren't from proper free ranging hens (just hens in barns with some access to the outside, which few of them were able to take advantage of) so one might as well buy cheap eggs. :o To me, that's like saying you might as well support a rodent farm, because a reputable breeder doesn't offer their rats the same life as your average pet owner with only one cage. Yes, few choices are perfect... but there are generally some choices that are better than others.
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Gecko » Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:08 am

Ugh, reading this makes me feel awful. I really want to avoid PAH now, but it's the most convenient petshop around. I know I can source things online but it's always more expensive. I don't know, I feel terrible; but I know that even if I boycott buying animals from there buying items from PAH is still lining their pockets.. :(

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Neotoma » Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:24 am

Gecko wrote:Ugh, reading this makes me feel awful. I really want to avoid PAH now, but it's the most convenient petshop around. I know I can source things online but it's always more expensive. I don't know, I feel terrible; but I know that even if I boycott buying animals from there buying items from PAH is still lining their pockets.. :(


But do you really need a petshop at all (this isn't a dig by the way - just a suggestion) - we bed down on biocatolet and ripped up newspaper (supermarkets), feed on a homemade grain mix (supermarkets and health food shops - if you don't fancy that, there may be someone nearby willing to sell you ready made SD, or split a bag of base food), and use teatowels as hammocks (second hand shops, although there are lots of small scale hammock sellers on here if you want 'proper' ones). Toys are random bits and bobs (old cardboard is very popular). The current top attraction in the cage is a semi-circular garden hanging basket stuffed with a large amount of newspaper.

The only things I've had to buy from a specialist shop were the cages (online, plus a second hand Freddy), and the triangular litter trays (which did come from a petshop, although I plan to get future ones online).

Also bear in mind that while boycotting animal-stocking petshops altogether would probably have more impact, buying animals from there sends the message that stocking animals is ok, whereas buying other stuff lines their pockets, but doesn't specifically tell them there is profit in selling animals. So even if you have to shop there for other things, that's still not a good reason to buy rats from them. If that made sense...
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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by Gecko » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:50 pm

Neotoma wrote:
Gecko wrote:Ugh, reading this makes me feel awful. I really want to avoid PAH now, but it's the most convenient petshop around. I know I can source things online but it's always more expensive. I don't know, I feel terrible; but I know that even if I boycott buying animals from there buying items from PAH is still lining their pockets.. :(


But do you really need a petshop at all (this isn't a dig by the way - just a suggestion) - we bed down on biocatolet and ripped up newspaper (supermarkets), feed on a homemade grain mix (supermarkets and health food shops - if you don't fancy that, there may be someone nearby willing to sell you ready made SD, or split a bag of base food), and use teatowels as hammocks (second hand shops, although there are lots of small scale hammock sellers on here if you want 'proper' ones). Toys are random bits and bobs (old cardboard is very popular). The current top attraction in the cage is a semi-circular garden hanging basket stuffed with a large amount of newspaper.

The only things I've had to buy from a specialist shop were the cages (online, plus a second hand Freddy), and the triangular litter trays (which did come from a petshop, although I plan to get future ones online).

Also bear in mind that while boycotting animal-stocking petshops altogether would probably have more impact, buying animals from there sends the message that stocking animals is ok, whereas buying other stuff lines their pockets, but doesn't specifically tell them there is profit in selling animals. So even if you have to shop there for other things, that's still not a good reason to buy rats from them. If that made sense...


Yes, it make perfect sense, and it's fine, I don't see it as a dig at all, infact I agree. :)
To be honest, I don't see the actual concept of pet shops as bad, just the awful way in which they're currently being handled. But I have resolved to source away from petshops now, specifically PAH, if only to give me peace of mind that I'm not contributing to awful things like that rodent farm.

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by arcticmonkee » Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:56 pm

I worked at a certain pet shop, these are the exact containers that the rats were bought to us in...seems the makeshift hamster cages we put them in were their first steps out of their birth cages. Horrendous.

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Re: Visit to a rodent farm (with pics!)

Post by littlebabyribbon » Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:45 pm

Popticle - when my ex boss used to order dwarf hamsters, he got them from simons rodents. They were absolutly wild, and no amount of trying seemed to calm them, alot of them came back. They arrived in corrugated plastic and mesh boxes that were taped shut. They squeaked loudly even when you went near their cage, it was a nightmare getting them out. I have heard of another shop tha got guineas from them that al arrived riddled in mites, and even a few of them died. :cry:

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